AMT Ladder Chief And Aero Chief

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AMT Ladder Chief And Aero Chief

Postby Chris on Sun Jan 27, 2008 2:33 pm

They are close to being the same so put your fixes for them here.
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Fix the weak turntable assemblies

Postby Jeff_C on Sun Jan 27, 2008 9:56 pm

This is to show you how to fix the weak turntable mountings on the AMT Aero-Chief and Ladder-Chief to prevent them from toppling over.

WHAT YOU NEED:

1.) 1 AMT Ladder-Chief or Aero-Chief kit

2.) 1 hobby knife (preferably the large handle X-Acto with the flat blade

3.) 1 sanding stick

4.) 1 flat tip screwdriver

5.) 1 pair of pliers or small Crescent wrench

6.) 1 steel 1 1/2" washer with 3/8" hole (for the Ladder-Chief)

7.) 1 steel 1 1/4" washer with 3/16" hole (for both kits)

8.) 1 steel SAE 1/4" washer with an outside diameter of 5/8" (for the Ladder-Chief)

9.) 1 #8-32 X 3/4" (or 1") flathead machine screw

10.) 2 #8-32 nuts for machine screw (only need 1 for Aero-Chief)

11.) 2 #8 nylon washers (only need 1 for Aero-Chief)

12.) 1 small drillbit with pin-vice

13.) 1 9/16" drillbit

14.) 1 1/4" drillbit

15.) 1 5/16 X 1/8" aluminimum spacer (for Ladder-Chief)

16.) 1 Marker

17.) 1 Small tube of light duty thread lock


INSTRUCTIONS:

Step 1: (For both) Take turntable section, flip it over so the "stub" is facing up. Mark the center of it. Use small drillbit with the pin-vice to drill a pilot hole. After drilling the pilot hole, take the 9/16" bit to drill a bigger hole. Once the bigger hole is drilled, flip the turntable rightside up, and use the 1/4" bit to make a shallow depression for a counter sink (don't go too deep or you'll weaken or break off the stub). Take the machine screw, and screw it into place using the screwdriver. It's going to be snug, but the screw will tap itself into the plastic. Before the screw is all the way in, use a small drop of epoxy in the countersink hole, and drive the screw the rest of the way. **DO NOT OVER TIGHTEN!** You may crack the turntable or strip the hole if you do. NOTE: The screw will stick up just a little bit. You can hide it with some plastic scrap if you want to.
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Step 2A: (For Ladder-Chief) Take the riser box, flip it upside down, and take the large 1 1/2" washer, center it on the raised ring around the mounting hole. Trace along the inside of the washer with a marker. Remove washer, and take the flat hobby knife and make a series of cuts around the outline by pressing down on the handle, and carefully remove the excess material. Place the large 1 1/2" washer over the ring you just trimmed. It should lay flush with the underside. if it doesn't trim as needed. If it does, use a little bit of epoxy to attach it to the underside of the riser, and if you so choose you can run a thin bead of epoxy around the outside to overlap the edge of the washer.
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Step 2B: (For Ladder-Chief) Take sanding stick and lightly sand the mounting hole in the body. Place the 5/16"x1/8" Aluminimum spacer in hole (you may need to tap it in BECAUSE IT SHOULD BE SNUG) The spacer must be flush with the underside of the deck. IF YOU CAN'T FIND THE SPACER, THEN YOU CAN SKIP THIS STEP. You can skip this step altogether if you choose, since it's your kit not mine (since I'm over engineering thigs a little)
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Step 2C: (For both) Take the top deck of the body, flip it upside down, take one 1 1/4" washer, place it centered on mounting hole between the ribs and secure with a little bit of epoxy.
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Step 3A: (For Ladder-Chief) Once epoxy is dry, place the tuntable on the riser box and flip upside down. Place one 1/4" washer over the screw and the stub. Place one nylon washer over screw. Place one nut on screw, and and spin it til it's almost snug and place a drop of thread lock. Snug the nut down a little bit with the pliers while holding screw with the screwdriver. Once again do not over tighten, and test the turntable for free spinning motion and adjust if needed.
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Step 3B: (For Aero-Chief) Place turntable on the top deck, flip it over, and follow step 3A minus the 1/4" washer.

Step 4: (For Ladder-Chief) Glue turntable and riser box assembly on the body top deck aligning it with the little corner tabs on the deck. Flip it over once glue is set and follow step 3A minus the 1/4"washer.
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Step 5: Continue normal asembly
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Re: AMT Ladder Chief And Aero Chief

Postby cargostar on Thu Feb 07, 2008 9:40 pm

Just a quick tip. after assembling the "feet" on the stabalizers, glue a piece of plastic on the"down" side of the foot to cover up the gaps and joints that are visable when the stabilizers are retracted.
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Re: AMT Ladder Chief And Aero Chief

Postby Tiny 26 on Fri Feb 08, 2008 10:14 pm

:o duh!! Good tip, that's 1 of them little things that slip by.
GLARINGLY noticable now that you pointed it out. :lol:
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Re: AMT Ladder Chief And Aero Chief

Postby Jeff_C on Sun Apr 13, 2008 6:53 pm

You could even add a bigger plate to the outriggers since some departments welded the jack plates to them to cut down on set up time.

Image

Image

Round jack plates:

Image

Also of note, depending on the year built, some may have the longer outriggers, and I've noticed in a few photos that sometimes the rear outrigger is slightly longer than the front.
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Re: AMT Ladder Chief And Aero Chief

Postby GLMFAA1 on Mon Apr 14, 2008 12:13 am

To those fortunate to still have a kit and need research try this web site, http://www.aerochief.com/index.html
It researched the ALF Aero Chiefs and found all the Indians. Take note of the various lengths of the boom compared to the body. Excuse me if this is a repost from someone else or some other time or section, as I'm a 'probie' here, Happy modeling
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Re: AMT Ladder Chief And Aero Chief

Postby Jeff_C on Mon Apr 14, 2008 2:46 pm

GLMFAA1 wrote:To those fortunate to still have a kit and need research try this web site, http://www.aerochief.com/index.html
It researched the ALF Aero Chiefs and found all the Indians. Take note of the various lengths of the boom compared to the body. Excuse me if this is a repost from someone else or some other time or section, as I'm a 'probie' here, Happy modeling
Greg


The length is because the Aero Chief came in 3 different lengths (70ft, 80ft, 90ft), and then had either a single or tandem drive axle(s). Ones with tandems usually had a pump. In the photos I posted above, the top and bottom pics are the 80ft while the one in the middle is a 90ft.

The kit is probably closer to the 80ft rather than the 90ft that it has markings for. I tried contacting ALF about measurements or drawings for the booms to get a better idea as to what the kit really has but no response as of yet.

The kit is still available, since I usually see that and the Ladder Chief at the "local" hobby shops, plus there is usually about 4 or 5 of them on E-bay at any one time.
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Re: AMT Ladder Chief And Aero Chief

Postby Jeff_C on Wed Jul 02, 2008 11:54 am

Another tip:

Replace the hydraulic rams with metal rod. Either aluminium or steel would do the trick.

Also consider doing the same with the boom and basket pivots points on the Aero Chief.

In fact in the coming weeks I'll be working out the engineering for these modifications so that you will be able to display the boom or ladder extended without worry of the flimsey plastic snapping under the weight.
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Re: AMT Ladder Chief And Aero Chief

Postby GLMFAA1 on Wed Jul 02, 2008 1:46 pm

Another easy fix to display the booms up is to take a piece of clear vinyl tubing like airplane fuel line available at hobby shops and cut it lengthwise and place it over the rod portion of the cylinder at the desired height needed to extend the boom or aerial.
Stars at night. You see them due to the light traveling from them. What you see is the stars past. If you are seeing a star that's 6,000 yrs ago. Imagine somebody on that star looking at us. They'd be seeing us as 6,000 yrs ago. Which of those two is now?
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Re: AMT Ladder Chief And Aero Chief

Postby Jeff_C on Wed Jul 09, 2008 6:05 pm

GLMFAA1 wrote:Another easy fix to display the booms up is to take a piece of clear vinyl tubing like airplane fuel line available at hobby shops and cut it lengthwise and place it over the rod portion of the cylinder at the desired height needed to extend the boom or aerial.


The only small problem with that is that it won't fly if the model is entered in a show, and you still risk breaking the fragile rams.
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Re: AMT Ladder Chief And Aero Chief

Postby Jeff_C on Thu Aug 28, 2008 1:31 pm

Well after studying pics and looking at the kit boom, both the upper and lower parts are wrong.

There should be 2 triangular braces on the mount where the hydraulic ram mounts to the boom.

The litening holes on the underside of the lower boom are wrong. On the end closest to the knuckle instead of the oval holes in the kit there should be 2 square holes 1 small, one large. Towards the middle of the boom, there should be one additional oval shaped hole. Under the hydraulic ram, there should also be one additional hole.

Also, there should be a hole in the side of the boom above the lower 2 braces. As you come up the boom, you come to the 2 closely spaced braces, well just beyond the second one is where the hole should be.....See bottom link

Also the cross shaped bracing on either side of the knuckle is out of shape and too thick....The horizontal braces should line up across their tops with the forward one being thicker.

On some booms the undersides of the braces are boxed in. And either it's all of these braces or just two of pairs are boxed in, so you can make that correction depending on what rig you build.

The underside of the upper boom is also wrong.

From the basket working back towards the knuckle there should be 5 litening holes followed by an angular drop off that also has a round hole in it. It looks like this may be a square hole, but the angle of the middle linked pic it's hard to tell

http://www.aerochief.com/ALF719996.jpg

http://www.aerochief.com/ALF1412747.jpg

http://www.aerochief.com/ALF1212795.jpg

Also missing are the brackets for the water way.

I'm not sure how many, their locations, or what shape they should be at this point.

There are supposedly 3 or 4 of these in the state and I'll eventually get around to snapping some pics of them.
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Re: AMT Ladder Chief And Aero Chief

Postby bigdicbob on Mon Jun 27, 2011 5:08 pm

I think the longer outrigger jacks may have had something to do with a stability issue. A couple of these elevating platforms tipped over (Baltimore City, Pittsburgh?) It probably was attributed to "operator error" in the end. Who knows for sure. But longer jacks make for wider jack spread, and thus more stability. Look at the Baker Aerialscope's center jacks. They are huge, but none I can recall ever flipped.
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Re: AMT Ladder Chief And Aero Chief

Postby GLMFAA1 on Mon Jun 27, 2011 7:58 pm

bigdicbob wrote:I think the longer outrigger jacks may have had something to do with a stability issue. A couple of these elevating platforms tipped over (Baltimore City, Pittsburgh?) It probably was attributed to "operator error" in the end. Who knows for sure. But longer jacks make for wider jack spread, and thus more stability. Look at the Baker Aerialscope's center jacks. They are huge, but none I can recall ever flipped.

Only story I know of a Baker tipping was one that seated the jack on a manhole cover and collapsed it causing the Aerialscope to tip
Anybody else have data?
Stars at night. You see them due to the light traveling from them. What you see is the stars past. If you are seeing a star that's 6,000 yrs ago. Imagine somebody on that star looking at us. They'd be seeing us as 6,000 yrs ago. Which of those two is now?
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Re: AMT Ladder Chief And Aero Chief

Postby bigdicbob on Tue Jun 28, 2011 11:54 am

You know, I remember that now. OOPS! You'd never think of that happening would ya?
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Re: AMT Ladder Chief And Aero Chief

Postby Jeff_C on Sun Nov 23, 2014 10:57 pm

One thing I noticed is that the rear end sits a bit too low. A quick fix I did was to mount the rear leaf springs with the tab resting on the bottom of the frame instead of in the slot. Raises the rear by 1/8 to 3/16ths of an inch to better match photos I've see with a bigger gap between the rear tires and the fender than what the kit has if assembled exactly according to the instructions.

I'll have some pics up in a few days.
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Re: AMT Ladder Chief And Aero Chief

Postby Jeff_C on Sun Nov 30, 2014 11:36 pm

Well here are the pics to show what I'm talking about:

Image

Image

As you can see I placed the locater tab on the underside of the frame as opposed to in the slot to raise the rear end up to get this:

Image

Compared to "stock" ride height:

Image
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Re: AMT Ladder Chief And Aero Chief

Postby Modelmaker on Mon Dec 01, 2014 12:43 am

Jeff, Thanks for the tip, I'll have to remember that next time I build one of these....I have 1 each of the ladder and the Snorkel sitting on my to do shelf....Gary
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Re: AMT Ladder Chief And Aero Chief

Postby Jeff_C on Mon Dec 01, 2014 1:03 am

Even with the fix it still doesn't look right to me as compared to pics I've found. I'm thinking that the rear compartments may be too tall but I don't know because I can never find any actual measurements.
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Re: AMT Ladder Chief And Aero Chief

Postby GLMFAA1 on Mon Dec 01, 2014 4:46 pm

Jeff_C wrote:Even with the fix it still doesn't look right to me as compared to pics I've found. I'm thinking that the rear compartments may be too tall but I don't know because I can never find any actual measurements.

Well lets see if this helps. The drawing are from ALF and are marked as 1/16th scale, so each 16th on the ruler is an inch.
Image
Image
The ruler is only !/8th so I figure it is 33 inches height
Image
The scale on these are MM for comparison
Image
Image

so you can do the math and decide if AMT vs ALF
let me know if you need more info I will measure again

greg
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Re: AMT Ladder Chief And Aero Chief

Postby Jeff_C on Fri Dec 05, 2014 9:48 pm

Those measurements are great. I think AMT may have fudged their measurements.
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